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Unable to mount without root

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Tuxera CTO	What are the outputs of ntfs-3g --help ntfs-3g /dev/sda3 /media/windows id ls -l /dev /dev/sda3 ls -ld /media /media/windows ls -l $(which ntfs-3g)
Thu Jul 24, 2008 23:02
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	I will post those just as soon as that system finishes creating an image of the NTFS partition. Should be about an hour. You can find most of that information in my prior posts. I thought that it may be needed and as such posted it. I'll repost it all when partimage finishes unless I see something else here.
Thu Jul 24, 2008 23:37
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	Here's the info, with the username excluded for privacy reasons. @XPS:~$ ntfs-3g --help ntfs-3g 1.2712 integrated FUSE 27 - Third Generation NTFS Driver Copyright (C) 2006-2008 Szabolcs Szakacsits Copyright (C) 2005-2007 Yura Pakhuchiy Usage: ntfs-3g <device\|image_file> <mount_point> [-o option[,...]] Options: ro (read-only mount), force, remove_hiberfile, locale=, uid=, gid=, umask=, fmask=, dmask=, streams_interface=. Please see the details in the manual. Example: ntfs-3g /dev/sda1 /mnt/win -o force Ntfs-3g news, support and information: http://ntfs-3g.org @XPS:~$ ntfs-3g /dev/sda3 /media/windows Error opening '/dev/sda3': Permission denied Failed to mount '/dev/sda3': Permission denied Please check '/dev/sda3' and the ntfs-3g binary permissions, and the mounting user ID. More explanation is provided at http://ntfs-3g.org/support.html#unprivileged @XPS:~$ id uid=1000() gid=1000() groups=24(cdrom),29(audio),44(video),46(plugdev),100(users),104(netdev),106(powerdev),107(ntfsusers),1000() @XPS:~$ ls -l /dev /dev/sda brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 /dev/sda /dev: total 0 crw-rw---- 1 root audio 14, 12 2008-07-24 14:44 adsp crw-rw---- 1 root video 10, 175 2008-07-24 14:44 agpgart crw-rw---- 1 root audio 14, 4 2008-07-24 14:44 audio crw-rw---- 1 root audio 14, 20 2008-07-24 14:44 audio1 drwxr-xr-x 3 root root 60 2008-07-24 14:44 bus lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 4 2008-07-24 14:44 cdrom -> scd0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 4 2008-07-24 14:44 cdrw -> scd0 crw------- 1 root root 5, 1 2008-07-24 18:44 console lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 11 2008-07-24 14:44 core -> /proc/kcore drwxr-xr-x 6 root root 120 2008-07-24 14:44 disk crw-rw---- 1 root audio 14, 3 2008-07-24 14:44 dsp crw-rw---- 1 root audio 14, 19 2008-07-24 14:44 dsp1 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 4 2008-07-24 14:44 dvd -> scd0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 4 2008-07-24 14:44 dvdrw -> scd0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 13 2008-07-24 14:44 fd -> /proc/self/fd crw-rw-rw- 1 root root 1, 7 2008-07-24 14:44 full crw-rw-rw- 1 root root 10, 229 2008-07-24 18:44 fuse crw-rw---- 1 root root 10, 228 2008-07-24 14:44 hpet prw------- 1 root root 0 2008-07-24 14:44 initctl drwxr-xr-x 4 root root 320 2008-07-24 18:45 input crw-r----- 1 root kmem 1, 2 2008-07-24 14:44 kmem crw-rw---- 1 root root 1, 11 2008-07-24 14:44 kmsg srw-rw-rw- 1 root root 0 2008-07-24 18:44 log drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 60 2008-07-24 14:44 loop brw-rw---- 1 root disk 7, 0 2008-07-24 18:44 loop0 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 7, 1 2008-07-24 18:44 loop1 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 7, 2 2008-07-24 18:44 loop2 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 7, 3 2008-07-24 18:44 loop3 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 7, 4 2008-07-24 18:44 loop4 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 7, 5 2008-07-24 18:44 loop5 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 7, 6 2008-07-24 18:44 loop6 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 7, 7 2008-07-24 18:44 loop7 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 13 2008-07-24 14:44 MAKEDEV -> /sbin/MAKEDEV drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 60 2008-07-24 18:44 mapper crw-r----- 1 root kmem 1, 1 2008-07-24 14:44 mem crw-rw---- 1 root audio 14, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 mixer crw-rw---- 1 root audio 14, 16 2008-07-24 14:44 mixer1 drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 60 2008-07-24 14:44 net crw-rw-rw- 1 root root 1, 3 2008-07-24 14:44 null crw-r----- 1 root kmem 1, 4 2008-07-24 14:44 port crw------- 1 root root 108, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 ppp crw-rw---- 1 root root 10, 1 2008-07-24 14:44 psaux crw-rw-rw- 1 root root 5, 2 2008-07-24 18:51 ptmx drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 0 2008-07-24 14:44 pts crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp0 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 1 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp1 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 2 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp2 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 3 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp3 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 4 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp4 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 5 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp5 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 6 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp6 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 7 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp7 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 8 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp8 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 9 2008-07-24 14:44 ptyp9 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 10 2008-07-24 14:44 ptypa crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 11 2008-07-24 14:44 ptypb crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 12 2008-07-24 14:44 ptypc crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 13 2008-07-24 14:44 ptypd crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 14 2008-07-24 14:44 ptype crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 2, 15 2008-07-24 14:44 ptypf brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 ram0 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 1 2008-07-24 14:44 ram1 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 10 2008-07-24 14:44 ram10 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 11 2008-07-24 14:44 ram11 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 12 2008-07-24 14:44 ram12 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 13 2008-07-24 14:44 ram13 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 14 2008-07-24 14:44 ram14 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 15 2008-07-24 14:44 ram15 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 2 2008-07-24 14:44 ram2 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 3 2008-07-24 14:44 ram3 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 4 2008-07-24 14:44 ram4 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 5 2008-07-24 14:44 ram5 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 6 2008-07-24 14:44 ram6 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 7 2008-07-24 14:44 ram7 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 8 2008-07-24 14:44 ram8 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 1, 9 2008-07-24 14:44 ram9 crw-rw-rw- 1 root root 1, 8 2008-07-24 14:44 random crw-rw---- 1 root audio 10, 135 2008-07-24 14:44 rtc brw-rw---- 1 root cdrom 11, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 scd0 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 sda brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 1 2008-07-24 14:44 sda1 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 2 2008-07-24 14:44 sda2 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 3 2008-07-24 18:47 sda3 crw-rw---- 1 root root 21, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 sg0 crw-rw---- 1 root cdrom 21, 1 2008-07-24 14:44 sg1 drwxrwxrwt 2 root root 40 2008-07-24 14:44 shm crw-rw---- 1 root root 10, 231 2008-07-24 14:44 snapshot drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 260 2008-07-24 14:44 snd lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 24 2008-07-24 14:44 sndstat -> /proc/asound/oss/sndstat lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 4 2008-07-24 14:44 sr0 -> scd0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 15 2008-07-24 14:44 stderr -> /proc/self/fd/2 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 15 2008-07-24 14:44 stdin -> /proc/self/fd/0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 15 2008-07-24 14:44 stdout -> /proc/self/fd/1 crw-rw-rw- 1 root root 5, 0 2008-07-24 18:44 tty crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 tty0 crw------- 1 root root 4, 1 2008-07-24 18:44 tty1 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 10 2008-07-24 14:44 tty10 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 11 2008-07-24 14:44 tty11 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 12 2008-07-24 14:44 tty12 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 13 2008-07-24 14:44 tty13 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 14 2008-07-24 14:44 tty14 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 15 2008-07-24 14:44 tty15 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 16 2008-07-24 14:44 tty16 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 17 2008-07-24 14:44 tty17 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 18 2008-07-24 14:44 tty18 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 19 2008-07-24 14:44 tty19 crw------- 1 root root 4, 2 2008-07-24 18:44 tty2 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 20 2008-07-24 14:44 tty20 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 21 2008-07-24 14:44 tty21 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 22 2008-07-24 14:44 tty22 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 23 2008-07-24 14:44 tty23 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 24 2008-07-24 14:44 tty24 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 25 2008-07-24 14:44 tty25 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 26 2008-07-24 14:44 tty26 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 27 2008-07-24 14:44 tty27 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 28 2008-07-24 14:44 tty28 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 29 2008-07-24 14:44 tty29 crw------- 1 root root 4, 3 2008-07-24 18:44 tty3 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 30 2008-07-24 14:44 tty30 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 31 2008-07-24 14:44 tty31 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 32 2008-07-24 14:44 tty32 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 33 2008-07-24 14:44 tty33 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 34 2008-07-24 14:44 tty34 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 35 2008-07-24 14:44 tty35 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 36 2008-07-24 14:44 tty36 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 37 2008-07-24 14:44 tty37 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 38 2008-07-24 14:44 tty38 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 39 2008-07-24 14:44 tty39 crw------- 1 root root 4, 4 2008-07-24 18:44 tty4 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 40 2008-07-24 14:44 tty40 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 41 2008-07-24 14:44 tty41 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 42 2008-07-24 14:44 tty42 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 43 2008-07-24 14:44 tty43 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 44 2008-07-24 14:44 tty44 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 45 2008-07-24 14:44 tty45 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 46 2008-07-24 14:44 tty46 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 47 2008-07-24 14:44 tty47 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 48 2008-07-24 14:44 tty48 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 49 2008-07-24 14:44 tty49 crw------- 1 root root 4, 5 2008-07-24 18:44 tty5 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 50 2008-07-24 14:44 tty50 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 51 2008-07-24 14:44 tty51 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 52 2008-07-24 14:44 tty52 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 53 2008-07-24 14:44 tty53 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 54 2008-07-24 14:44 tty54 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 55 2008-07-24 14:44 tty55 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 56 2008-07-24 14:44 tty56 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 57 2008-07-24 14:44 tty57 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 58 2008-07-24 14:44 tty58 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 59 2008-07-24 14:44 tty59 crw------- 1 root root 4, 6 2008-07-24 18:44 tty6 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 60 2008-07-24 14:44 tty60 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 61 2008-07-24 14:44 tty61 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 62 2008-07-24 14:44 tty62 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 63 2008-07-24 14:44 tty63 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 7 2008-07-24 14:44 tty7 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 8 2008-07-24 14:44 tty8 crw-rw---- 1 root root 4, 9 2008-07-24 14:44 tty9 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp0 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 1 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp1 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 2 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp2 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 3 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp3 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 4 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp4 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 5 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp5 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 6 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp6 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 7 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp7 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 8 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp8 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 9 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyp9 crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 10 2008-07-24 14:44 ttypa crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 11 2008-07-24 14:44 ttypb crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 12 2008-07-24 14:44 ttypc crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 13 2008-07-24 14:44 ttypd crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 14 2008-07-24 14:44 ttype crw-rw-rw- 1 root tty 3, 15 2008-07-24 14:44 ttypf crw-rw---- 1 root dialout 4, 64 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyS0 crw-rw---- 1 root dialout 4, 65 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyS1 crw-rw---- 1 root dialout 4, 66 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyS2 crw-rw---- 1 root dialout 4, 67 2008-07-24 14:44 ttyS3 crw-rw-rw- 1 root root 1, 9 2008-07-24 18:44 urandom crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev1.1_ep00 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev1.1_ep81 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 1 2008-07-24 18:45 usbdev1.2_ep00 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 1 2008-07-24 18:45 usbdev1.2_ep81 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 2048 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev2.1_ep00 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 2048 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev2.1_ep81 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 4096 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev3.1_ep00 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 4096 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev3.1_ep81 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 6144 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev4.1_ep00 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 6144 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev4.1_ep81 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 8192 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev5.1_ep00 crw-rw---- 1 root root 442, 8192 2008-07-24 14:44 usbdev5.1_ep81 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 0 2008-07-24 14:44 vcs crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 1 2008-07-24 18:44 vcs1 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 2 2008-07-24 18:44 vcs2 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 3 2008-07-24 18:44 vcs3 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 4 2008-07-24 18:44 vcs4 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 5 2008-07-24 18:44 vcs5 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 6 2008-07-24 18:44 vcs6 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 7 2008-07-24 18:44 vcs7 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 128 2008-07-24 14:44 vcsa crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 129 2008-07-24 18:44 vcsa1 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 130 2008-07-24 18:44 vcsa2 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 131 2008-07-24 18:44 vcsa3 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 132 2008-07-24 18:44 vcsa4 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 133 2008-07-24 18:44 vcsa5 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 134 2008-07-24 18:44 vcsa6 crw-rw---- 1 root root 7, 135 2008-07-24 18:44 vcsa7 prw-r----- 1 root adm 0 2008-07-24 18:50 xconsole crw-rw-rw- 1 root root 1, 5 2008-07-24 14:44 zero @XPS:~$ ls -ld /media /media/windows drwxr-xr-x 4 root root 4096 2008-07-24 14:03 /media drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 2008-07-24 14:03 /media/windows @XPS:~$ ls -l $(which ntfs-3g) -rwsr-x--- 1 root ntfsusers 98392 2008-07-23 14:45 /bin/ntfs-3g I simply deleted the user's name from the 'id' output. Her name appeared in the parenthesis as it should, but it is her real first name, which is why I am hiding it.
Fri Jul 25, 2008 00:54
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	The user indeed doesn't have right to access /dev/sda3 and mount on /media/windows. You need to fix both of them to be able to mount unprivileged.
Fri Jul 25, 2008 01:02
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 17:22 Posts: 1286	Hi Alternately you may create a shell script with all the relevant checks, and start it with sudo, with your specific user declared in /etc/sudoers as being allowed to start the script. Note : ntfs-3g is in user space, its requirements and behaviour have to be different from in-kernel file systems. Regards Jean-Pierre
Fri Jul 25, 2008 08:42
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	Well here is what I do not understand. Why does this identical setup work on every other machine I have done it on, and not this one? I would be willing to go as far as allowing either of you to SSH in to a limited account and view all three systems. All three are the same, but this one just isn't working, while the other two are. In fact, the only real difference between the three systems is the hardware that makes up the systems. So why do I have to do it differently here?
Fri Jul 25, 2008 17:20
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	I added my user to the disk group and changed ownership of /media/windows to 'root:ntfsusers' with the permissions of 660 (drw-rw----). Now I get this. user@XPS:~$ ntfs-3g /dev/sda3 /media/windows ntfs-3g-mount: failed to chdir to mountpoint: Permission denied user@XPS:~$ ls -l /media total 8 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 2008-07-18 19:58 cdrom -> cdrom0 drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 2008-07-18 19:58 cdrom0 drw-rw---- 2 root ntfsusers 4096 2008-07-24 14:03 windows Ideas?
Fri Jul 25, 2008 17:52
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	Note : ntfs-3g is in user space, its requirements and behaviour have to be different from in-kernel file systems. By design ntfs-3g should always behave exactly the same as in-kernel file systems. This case is different because none of the in-kernel file systems can provide running a file system driver unprivileged. This is one of the unique features of NTFS-3G. Here are the several scenarios: 1. root initiates mount, driver runs as root. 2. user initiates mount, driver runs as root. There are many, distribution specific solutions: http://ntfs-3g.org/support.html#plugandplay 3. user initiates mount, driver runs unprivileged: unique feature of NTFS-3G. It is allowed only if the needed requirements are meet discussed at http://ntfs-3g.org/support.html#useroption In Sephiroth's case the user had no right to the device and no right to the mount point, so all the error messages were correct. Regards, Szaka
Fri Jul 25, 2008 20:07
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	I added my user to the disk group and changed ownership of /media/windows to 'root:ntfsusers' with the permissions of 660 (drw-rw----). Now I get this. user@XPS:~$ ntfs-3g /dev/sda3 /media/windows ntfs-3g-mount: failed to chdir to mountpoint: Permission denied user@XPS:~$ ls -l /media total 8 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 2008-07-18 19:58 cdrom -> cdrom0 drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 2008-07-18 19:58 cdrom0 drw-rw---- 2 root ntfsusers 4096 2008-07-24 14:03 windows Ideas? As the error message says, the user doesn't have permission to enter /media/windows. So give the directory the needed permission: chmod 770 /media/windows
Fri Jul 25, 2008 20:09
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	I gave the directory the permission 660 since I don't want users to be able to attempt to execute Windows executables. Changing it to 770 will just add permission to execute files, which should grant an unprivileged user to enter the directory. However, I can go into that directory with the user account and look around, but there is obviously nothing there. This is what is confusing. The user CAN enter the directory in the shell, but NTFS-3G says that the user cannot?
Sat Jul 26, 2008 05:15
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	I gave the directory the permission 660 since I don't want users to be able to attempt to execute Windows executables. Changing it to 770 will just add permission to execute files, which should grant an unprivileged user to enter the directory. The 'x' bit on directories has nothing to do with file execution. It means if the user can enter the directory or not. So just follow what you were already advised at least five times earlier and use the 'noexec' mount option if you want to prevent users running files from the volume,
Sat Jul 26, 2008 10:31
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	So when was that change implemented? When I wa staught Linux years ago, those stood for Read, Write, and eXecute, which shows up as 'rwx' in a listing. Besides that, the user CAN enter that directory at will as-is. That is just confusing because I can take the user into the directory and dance in circles, but NTFS-3G says I cannot. Perhaps a tutorial on the new version of NTSF-3G should be posted, explaining that just because your user may enter a mount-point, it doesn't mean they can enter the mount-point for some reason. This is what had me confused. I also still want to know when x was changed from eXecute to 'you may enter this directory', which is what the user:group stuff was for.
Sat Jul 26, 2008 17:14
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	So when was that change implemented? Never. This is how 'x' is interpreted for directories by definition for about 40 years: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_syste ... ermissions Your misunderstanding comes from the wrong interpretation of the directory read permission. You think the user can enter but in fact she can't, only list the name of the files. The directory permissions are not obvious and many people misunderstands them. Of course this is not NTFS-3G specific, all Unix file systems behave the same.
Sat Jul 26, 2008 18:40
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	Alright I gotcha'. I was thinking of file permissions, where x is execute, unless I am mistaken. I'll make the change and if I have another issue, I'll report it. If this fixes the problem, my only concern is adding users to the 'disk' group. If I do this, won't this allow way too much access in the sense that they can then mount and unmount other partitions?
Sat Jul 26, 2008 20:21
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	Don't add users to the 'disk' group. Instead change the owner of the NTFS partition to which the NTFS users have access.
Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:39
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	I didn't think it was wise to change anything in /dev? I don't mind doing that, but only if it won't screw anything up or poke another hole in security. Also, I have updated this machine to your latest build and will do the same with the other one the next time it comes in. Works fine. However, does it work with Vista yet? I am working on a Vista laptop and the customer wants the same setup we use, where we make a restoration image on a Linux partition for emergencies, but I didn't think NTFS-3G worked with Vista partitions yet.
Sun Jul 27, 2008 17:23
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	Don't add users to the 'disk' group. Instead change the owner of the NTFS partition to which the NTFS users have access. I've been meaning to drop by and tell you that you can't change ownership of anything in /dev, and it gets reset at boot anyway. The only option IS to add users to the disk group. If I remove the users from the disk group, even though they have access to the mount-point and NTFS-3G stuff, it won't allow them to mount the device. Ideas?
Mon Aug 04, 2008 21:20
To get by the problem with permissions in /dev being reset you can create an udev-rule. See man udev I was helped by this article: http://www.redhat.com/magazine/002dec04/features/udev/. My problem was with an external USB-drive. I created the file '/etc/udev/rules.d/50-LaciePerm.rules' containg the rule SYSFS{product}'LaCie Hard Drive USB', SYSFS{serial}'10000E0009C24E5E', OWNER='root', GROUP='specdisk', MODE='660' identifying my drive uniquely and making sure it gets the right permissions. specdisk is the group for users allowed to mount ntfs-drives. I hope this helps.
Fri Aug 22, 2008 01:26
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	I still need a solution to this problem. I can understand the need for security, but when it is so secure that even legit users are unable to mount the partition without being in the disk group, something's wrong. I am on yet another laptop and have everything working except ntfs-3g. I can NOT add users to the disk group. There has to be some way that a normal user can mount an NTFS partition, or the program would be useless since most users do not have root access. I also cannot change ownership of the devices in /dev due to other applications and permissions.
Tue Sep 02, 2008 07:08
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 17:22 Posts: 1286	Hi, you can : - grant the access in an ACL (you do not want that, but that is the standard way to control access to local devices in some distributions), - create a shell script which does the mount after making all the relevant checks, and make it startable by sudo Regards Jean-Pierre
Tue Sep 02, 2008 08:21
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	I still need a solution to this problem. I can understand the need for security, but when it is so secure that even legit users are unable to mount the partition without being in the disk group, something's wrong. Apparently it's only you who wants the strongest security (full unprivileged mount). In most other cases root mounts the volume on behalf of a user or group by using the uid, gid, fmask, and dmask mount options or the security improved version from http://pagesperso-orange.fr/b.andre/security.html None of the main Linux file system supports what you want, only ntfs-3g and the strict security checks are the price for this. So, perhaps you could also just use the distribution specific solution described at http://ntfs-3g.org/support.html#plugandplay and be happy like any other people?
Tue Sep 02, 2008 12:03
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	You misunderstand me, I do NOT want the security this tight. Right now the only way possible to make this work is to add users to the 'disk' group, which is an incredible security hole since they then have access to all disk devices. In prior versions of NTFS-3G, this was not needed and I can remember simply having to make a group and assign users to it to allow a mount or unmount. This is the dilemma I have. I either give regular users full disk access so they can use NTFS-3G, or I give them none like normal, and NTFS access is gone.
Wed Sep 10, 2008 04:22
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	Old NTFS-3G versions had a local root exploit which was fixed. Many distributions supports what you want out of the box without modifying any permissions anywhere. I suggest check out one of them (e.g. Ubuntu, Fedora, Mandrake) how they do what you want. NTFS-3G supports and can be used in quite many ways. Good luck!
Wed Sep 10, 2008 12:24
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	Not trying to dig up this old thread, but I installed Debian Lenny AMD64, got everything working, installed FUSE and NTFS-3G, did the chmod and chown on the help page as usual, created /media/windows and set it to 776 and owned by root and the ntfsusers group as before, but now nobody except root can mount. This is using 1.5130 on the main page. The exact commands I entered after compiling and installing FUSE and NTFS-3G follow. chown root:ntfsusers $(which ntfs-3g) chmod 4750 $(which ntfs-3g) mkdir /media/windows chown -R root:ntfsusers /media/windows chmod -R 776 /media/windows My user account is a member of the ntfsusers group and I have gone as far as rebooting to ensure that I am in that group. I have since tried changing permissions to 777 on the mount-point and STILL no go. It is setup in /etc/fstab to mount /dev/hda3 on /media/windows, and root can mount the drive simply by doing 'mount /dev/hda3'. Is this a new bug or have I left out a step?
Tue Jan 06, 2009 22:43
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	What are the outputs of ntfs-3g --help ntfs-3g /dev/sda3 /media/windows id ls -l /dev/sda3 ls -ld /media /media/windows ls -l $(which ntfs-3g)
Tue Jan 06, 2009 23:34

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Unable to mount without root

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Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	Unable to mount without root Alright, I have read the FAQ and tried the second option (the one using chmod 4750) since the first was risky, and I still cannot mount my NTFS partition as anybody except root. The system is nothing special, just an Acer Aspire 5102WLMi laptop running Debian Etch and XP Pro x64 Edition. I just today compiled and installed fuse 2.7.1 and ntfs-3g 1.1120. My first goal was just to mount the drive, and at first I was getting permission denial errors as my normal user, but now hat did the chmod fix on this site, I get no error but the drive never mounts. Before I ask for any help though, I should state that I created a group called 'ntfsusers' that I intend on using to grant mount permission in the long-run. This way if I allow a friend on the machine under a new account, they cannot mount my XP partition. So how would I setup mounting in this fashion? My fstab is pasted below, # /etc/fstab: static file system information. # # <file system> <mount point> <type> <options> <dump> <pass> proc /proc proc defaults 0 0 /dev/hda1 / ext3 defaults,errors=remount-ro 0 1 /dev/hda2 none swap sw 0 0 /dev/hda3 /media/windows ntfs-3g rw,user,noauto 0 0 /dev/hdb /media/cdrom0 udf,iso9660 user,noauto 0 0
Fri Nov 30, 2007 01:38
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	What's the output of ntfs-3g /dev/hda3 /media/windows cat /proc/mounts ls -l $(which ntfs-3g)
Fri Nov 30, 2007 01:52
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	As my normal user: sephiroth@AcerLaptop:~$ ntfs-3g /dev/hda3 /media/windows bash: /bin/ntfs-3g: Permission denied sephiroth@AcerLaptop:~$ As root: AcerLaptop:~# ntfs-3g /dev/hda3 /media/windows AcerLaptop:~# cat /proc/mounts rootfs / rootfs rw 0 0 none /sys sysfs rw 0 0 none /proc proc rw 0 0 udev /dev tmpfs rw 0 0 /dev/hda1 / ext3 rw,data=ordered 0 0 /dev/hda1 /dev/.static/dev ext3 rw,data=ordered 0 0 tmpfs /lib/init/rw tmpfs rw,nosuid 0 0 usbfs /proc/bus/usb usbfs rw,nosuid,nodev,noexec 0 0 tmpfs /dev/shm tmpfs rw,nosuid,nodev 0 0 devpts /dev/pts devpts rw,nosuid,noexec 0 0 fusectl /sys/fs/fuse/connections fusectl rw 0 0 /dev/hda3 /media/windows fuseblk rw,nosuid,nodev,user_id=0,group_id=0,allow_other 0 0 AcerLaptop:~# ls -l $(which ntfs-3g) -rwsr-x--- 1 root ntfsusers 122582 2007-11-29 12:51 /bin/ntfs-3g AcerLaptop:~# Also, I must say that it's impressive to see a lead developer responding to forum posts, especially on such a large project. You don't get that on most payware product forums.
Fri Nov 30, 2007 01:56
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	Everything looks fine. The mounting user is either not in the ntfsusers group or you didn't login/logoff, so it wasn't taken in use yet.
Fri Nov 30, 2007 13:38
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	I had logged in and out several times while testing my own tools to crack WEP/WPA networks since I have made them for the shell, and prefer to test at the true shell as root. However, I just now booted the laptop for the first time today and it worked, which leads me to believe that I had to reboot for the changes to take effect. I do have one final question though. What exactly did I modify when I followed your FAQ instructions and did 'chmod 4750 $(where ntfs-3g)'? I am assuming it modded every file with ntfs-3g in the name to 4750. If this is the case, what was the default value in case I ever need to revert to it? Oh, and since I did that modification, will ntfs-3g still honor the 'noexec' parameter in fstab?
Fri Nov 30, 2007 18:02
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	> What exactly did I modify when I followed your FAQ instructions and did > 'chmod 4750 $(where ntfs-3g)'? I am assuming it modded every file with > ntfs-3g in the name to 4750. No. The ntfs-3g permission was changed to 4750 (rwsr-x---), so only the configured user in the group can mount. > If this is the case, what was the default value in case I ever need to > revert to it? 755 > Oh, and since I did that modification, will ntfs-3g still honor the 'noexec' > parameter in fstab? Yes, it's still honored.
Fri Nov 30, 2007 18:43
Hi, everybody, I've got a similar problem. Before asking questions I did a modest research and I'm curious. Where is FAQ which the author of this tread is referring to? Where is ntfs-3g manual? Even Google presented me only with the ntfs-3g main page where the manual is just mentioned (no link). The history: PCLinuxOS system, ntfs-3g driver from it's repository; everything is fine up to a certain moment, coinciding with the installation of VirtualBox. Now I can mount and access my NTFS partition only as root. The only think I can put my finger on is the absence of ntfsusers group on my machine. Is it mandatory? Maybe a bug in the VirtualBox package destroyed the group, or something like that? Any suggestions? Best regards, Alexey
Sun Jan 27, 2008 12:36
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	Unable to mount without root On Sun, 27 Jan 2008, Alexey931 wrote: I've got a similar problem. Before asking questions I did a modest research and I'm curious. Where is FAQ which the author of this tread is referring to? On the NTFS-3G web site. This question is answered at http://ntfs-3g.org/support.html#useroption Where is ntfs-3g manual? Installed on your computer. Type 'man ntfs-3g' or use any of your favorite tool to search and browse the OS manuals.
Sun Jan 27, 2008 12:55
Installed on your computer. :lol: Thanks!
Sun Jan 27, 2008 13:52
After applying # chown root $(which ntfs-3g) # chmod 4755 $(which ntfs-3g) I can user-mount my NTFS partition, but unmounting can still be done only with root privileges. I can live with that, but it isn't pretty :) . Is there a way to streamline it? Grateful in advance, Alexey
Mon Jan 28, 2008 13:21
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	The umount utility is broken unfortunately but 'fusermount -u <mountpoint>' should work.
Mon Jan 28, 2008 22:40
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	I hate to dig up an old thread, but I am experiencing this AGAIN on a Dell XPS laptop running Debian Etch 32bit, FUSE 2.7.3, and NTSF-3G 1.2712. I have done the normal 'chown' and 'chmod' commands in the FAQ, rebooted, and still no luck. Only root can mount and unmount the partition. My user is a member of the 'ntfsusers' group, and 'chown root:ntfsusers $(which ntfs-3g)' should have set that. I have done that and the chmod line with both 4750 and 4755, and rebooted, and neither works. What in the world is wrong?
Wed Jul 23, 2008 05:32
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	Thought I would post the problem from the machine with the problem! These are pasted right out of the konsole window, being run as the regular user. As you can see, everything appears right, but it isn't working. This user is in the 'ntfsusers' group, according to kuser. Mounting attempts: user@XPS:~$ mount /dev/sda3 Error opening '/dev/sda3': Permission denied Failed to mount '/dev/sda3': Permission denied Please check '/dev/sda3' and the ntfs-3g binary permissions, and the mounting user ID. More explanation is provided at http://ntfs-3g.org/support.html#unprivileged user@XPS:~$ ntfs-3g /dev/sda3 /media/windows Error opening '/dev/sda3': Permission denied Failed to mount '/dev/sda3': Permission denied Please check '/dev/sda3' and the ntfs-3g binary permissions, and the mounting user ID. More explanation is provided at http://ntfs-3g.org/support.html#unprivileged Permissions: user@XPS:~$ ls -l $(which ntfs-3g) -rwsr-x--- 1 root ntfsusers 98392 2008-07-20 22:40 /bin/ntfs-3g Mount info: user@XPS:~$ cat /proc/mounts rootfs / rootfs rw 0 0 none /sys sysfs rw 0 0 none /proc proc rw 0 0 udev /dev tmpfs rw 0 0 /dev/sda1 / ext3 rw,data=ordered 0 0 /dev/sda1 /dev/.static/dev ext3 rw,data=ordered 0 0 tmpfs /lib/init/rw tmpfs rw,nosuid 0 0 usbfs /proc/bus/usb usbfs rw,nosuid,nodev,noexec 0 0 tmpfs /dev/shm tmpfs rw,nosuid,nodev 0 0 devpts /dev/pts devpts rw,nosuid,noexec 0 0 fusectl /sys/fs/fuse/connections fusectl rw 0 0 So what in the world could be causing this? I have been held up for three days with this laptop due to this problem. I need to finish this and get it back to the user, but it just plain refuses to work!
Wed Jul 23, 2008 18:01
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 17:22 Posts: 1286	Hi, According to the FAQ : Unprivileged block device mounts work only if NTFS-3G is compiled with integrated FUSE support, the ntfs-3g binary is at least version 1.2506, set to setuid-root, and the user has access rights to the volume and mount point. Did you check all the conditions ? I see no indications for : ls -l /dev/sda3 ls -ld /media/windows grep ntfsusers /etc/group Regards Jean-Pierre
Wed Jul 23, 2008 19:22
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	The device 'sda3' is owned by 'root:disk', like all the other sda partitions. The mount-point '/media/windows' is a copy of '/media/cdrom0', which has worked on the AMD64 build. As for the group results, it only contains the user account name, as that person is the only user. I also checked gshadow, and that user is the only one in the group there as well.
Wed Jul 23, 2008 20:17
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 17:22 Posts: 1286	Hi, The device 'sda3' is owned by 'root:disk' If the mode is the usual 640 no user can access it. You may want to grant access to group ntfsuser by : setfacl -m g:ntfsuser:rw /dev/sda3 The same might go for /media/windows Regards Jean-Pierre
Wed Jul 23, 2008 21:11
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	That shouldn't be the issue. This laptop is also running Debian Etch and NTFS-3G, and I just checked the three partitions. The root user and disk group own all three here also, and this normal account I am posting with can mount and unmount the 'hda3' partition with ease. Note that this laptop has an older PATA HDD, so they are hda, and the new laptop has SATA, which is sda. I followed the exact same steps on both laptops and this one works while the other one doesn't, which is driving me insane. This laptop: AcerLaptop:~# cd /dev AcerLaptop:/dev# l hda* brw-rw---- 1 root disk 3, 0 2008-07-23 18:20 hda brw-rw---- 1 root disk 3, 1 2008-07-23 18:20 hda1 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 3, 2 2008-07-23 18:20 hda2 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 3, 3 2008-07-23 18:20 hda3 AcerLaptop:/dev# Dell XPS Laptop: XPS:~# cd /dev XPS:/dev# l sda* brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 0 2008-07-23 18:20 sda brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 1 2008-07-23 18:20 sda1 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 2 2008-07-23 18:20 sda2 brw-rw---- 1 root disk 8, 3 2008-07-23 18:20 sda3 XPS:/dev# As you can see, they're identical, except the '3' is '8' on the new system. Not sure what that indicates, as I normally don't play around in /dev! Still, the permissions are the same. I also checked and /media/cdrom0 and /media/windows have identical permissions. I can mount CDROMs, but not the NTFS partition. If it matters, both laptops are setup with hda1 being ext3 for Debian, hda2 as a 2GB swap partition, and hda3 as an NTFS system with XP Pro 32bit on the XPS and XP Pro x64 on this one. We use Linux for work and for keeping an image of a fresh install of XP on the third partition. This way we can simply copy our data files to a backup server or shared folder, restore the image, perform a Windows Update, make a new image, copy our data files back, and we're up and running with a clean install as if we'd done a full day of formatting and such!
Thu Jul 24, 2008 04:37
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 23:15 Posts: 1648	> That shouldn't be the issue. Exactly that's the issue what Jean-Pierre told. This is how the functionality was design, implemented and documented: http://www.ntfs-3g.org/support.html#useroption Earlier NTFS-3G versions didn't require this which was a security hole, so we fixed it. Regards, Szaka
Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:52
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	So what version first implemented this fix? I know that this version is newer than the one on the XPS laptop (I am on the Acer laptop now), but I didn't think that it was very old. I also find it odd that one can mount a CD/DVD device with the same permissions as the HD device, but not the HD device. Why is that? Oh and what exactly is the command he posted above, I have never seen it before and am leary about using it on my system until I know what it does.
Thu Jul 24, 2008 17:13
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	Just wanted to say that I found information on that command and understand it now. I haven't had to use it in eons, but after reading about it, something in the back of my mind screams at me from my shudder RedHat days. Oh and this laptop is using version 1.1120 of NTFS-3G. Is this prior to the security fix?
Thu Jul 24, 2008 17:24
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	I hate to make a third post, but I cannot edit my own posts, and I have another problem. The command 'setfacl' is apparently not valid in Debian Etch, and a quick search for 'setfacl' with the package-manager returned nothing. So what do I do?
Thu Jul 24, 2008 17:33
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	Alright I found it as a package. However, after installing and attempting to use the exact command posted above, I get '/dev/sda3: operation not supported'. Maybe Debian doesn't use ACL in the stock kernel or something? Do I have to play with ACLs to make this work? It is turning out to be one gigantic headache and time-killer just to make it work at all. I didn't have to modify the ACL for other partitions or CD/DVD devices to allow the user on that machine to mount/unmount them, so why on earth would this one be different?
Thu Jul 24, 2008 17:45
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	I wanted to note that all of my Linux systems (all are Debian Etch) appear to have 660 as the default for all devices, including /dev/sda3. I have tried using 666, but my user still cannot mount the device. I also have no way of knowing whether or not my kernel supports ACL, but I cannot get setfacl to work at all, on any file. I am assuming that my kernel does not support ACL at this point, which is fine by me. How else can I get this device mountable by a normal user?
Thu Jul 24, 2008 19:54
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 17:22 Posts: 1286	Hi, I have tried using 666, but my user still cannot mount the device Do you still get '/dev/sda3': Permission denied' ? And are you sure the user can access the mount point ? I suggested using an ACL, which is the way fedora/gnome uses to grant access to local devices (printer, cdrom, audio, etc.) only to the user logged on the desktop. I have made a try with a Knoppix live-cd (based on Debian, with no apparent ACL support) and KDE. For the same purpose, it apparently puts the user logged on the desktop into groups audio, cdrom etc. You might do the same way, putting your specific user into group disk. Regards Jean-Pierre
Thu Jul 24, 2008 21:52
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 06:32 Posts: 28 Location: North Carolina	The other systems that use your program do not have the users in the 'disk' group and they have no problems. I did try that earlier though, and I then got an error about not being able to access '/media/windows'. Knowing that was utter BS, I mounted the partition as root, then went right into that directory as my user and proceeded to delete the pagefile and hibernation file. My user had full read/write access as intended, but is unable to mount the partition. This leads me to believe that there is a bug in the mounting utility provided by either FUSE or NTFS-3G on a system without ACL. If not, I am lost. The user can access '/media/windows' and '/media/cdrom' even though they're both owned by root:root, yet NTFS-3G doesn't see things this way and if my user is in the disk group, will complain about it. If I remove her from the disk group, she can't even get that far.
Thu Jul 24, 2008 22:23

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